This is my first interview with Mr. Pearson Kumbemba born in 1951, at Satikadzuwa Village, Traditional Authority Mponda, Mangochi District. Passport Number 182596. He travelled to South Africa to work in the mines under WNLA contract while very young at the age of 20. He was then unmarried. In 1974, you must have been very young?
PK:Very young, I was not married yet. I married when I came back in 1975.
EM:So, what motivated you to go to South Africa to work in the mines under WNLA?
PK:What drove me to migrate was the level poverty at home. We were very poor at home. I could not continue with school. Hence when I came back, I had saved enough money for my family, wedding, sending to school my children, start business.
EM:At your young age, you had already made up your mind that when you come back with the money you could start your life with marriage, send future children to school and start business?
PK:Exactly. As I knew without going to work in the mines in South Africa, I could not afford to achieve anything.
EM:So, you didn’t want to rely on parents’ assistance to start your life?
PK:No, no. Parents did not have anything to offer. They were in terrible poverty too.
EM:So how did you manage to go to South Africa? What was the process like?
PK:You just had to get registered. That’s all.
EM:Did you have to pay anybody to get the contract with WNLA?
PK:Not at all. When registered then you just had to leave to Johannesburg
EM:How did you travel? What means?
PK:We travelled by the railway
EM:Who paid for the tickets?
PK:It was paid upfront by Malawi Government
EM:Ok. I see. So, when you get there, they welcomed you?
EM:So, would that be a white man or African?
PK:It was an African. The white would be inside the mine. He was the head of operations in the mines. The majority outside were Africans.
EM:Ok. So, when you arrive in South Africa what happens?
PK:When we are welcomed at the mine, we were taken to mine school. There we were taught mine etiquette, and a common spoken language in the mine, (fanakalo)since we came into the mine from different countries. We needed a language for a group communication. Ukan kawena, ubani kawena? Who are you? Ubani khuma? Where are you coming from? Uba Sebenza khuti? Where do you work? Unakonalomanakazi? Do you have a wife? That’s the language.
EM:So how long did this training take?
PK:This training took almost 21days or 3 weeks. You by then know the language (fanakalo)
EM:Wow! Within three weeks you had mastered it?
PK:Yes, ready to work in the mine. This the bonus which was not given.
EM:Oh! This is bonus? Aah ok. Abadala besi
PK:Yes. Abadala besi. Meaning this is an elder who did not receive his bonus
EM:So, this is the sign that you did not receive your bonus?
PK:Yes. Those who received their bonus do not have this booklet
EM:So, this means you are entitled to receiving bonus? Like the compensations being talked about now in the media?
PK:Yes, they are not compensation per se but the unpaid bonuses.
EM:Oh! I see. I thought it was about some compensation based on the health issues.
PK:No! these about the unpaid bonuses they were to pay us when you go back to resume work in the mines. But in our case, we could not go back because then, the plane crashed. The plane crash ended the working agreement between WNLA and Malawi Government. No Malawian would again travel to the mine under WNLA.
EM:So, it was the plane crash that ended the WNLA contracts?
PK:Yes, when the plane crashed, many Malawians to the mines died. And Dr. Kamuzu Banda, the then president of the Republic of Malawi. stopped the whole contracts. So, we could not go again. The agreement was stopped.
EM:is that so? So many Malawian workers died on the plane crush?
PK:Yes, many died on their way to South Africa. So that’s when the Malawi government decided to end the contract. And that is why we did not go back to South Africa for the second time in 1975. This is also why those of us did not manage to receive our bonuses as outlined in this booklet.
EM:Is this the reason that now you are pushing for the South African Government to pay back your bonuses?
PK:That’s it. If we had gone back in 1975 like in my case, we could have received our bonuses.
EM:Ok, Mr. Kumbemba, you went to South Africa in 1972?
PK:Yes, I went to South Africa in 1973 and back in 1974
EM:So, when did the plane crash?
EM:Ok. Now, so far, we have agreed that I can do the interview with you, ask you questions, publish what we discuss today on website or documented into book? (Consent)
PK:Yes, sir go ahead. We need that even our grandchildren to be able to read and understand what we did while young,
EM:How was your childhood in the village you grew up?
PK:I had a normal childhood. In the village like any boy. We had so much poverty though.
EM:So how did you reach this decision to go to South Africa to work in the mines?
PK:When I finished my grade 8 (STD 8, Primary School Leaving Certificate), I knew I was not going anywhere due to poverty in the family. This is the time I decided to start processing the WNLA contract.
EM:Was there an academic prerequisite for one to be allowed to go to work in the mines?
PK:Not at all. There was not a requirement perse. There was no qualification whatsoever, just your physicality and good health.
EM:At your household you were many, and you managed to go to school. Who was responsible for your school fees then?
PK:My parents managed to be paying for my school fees.
EM:How did your parents manage to pay for your fees?
PK:My parents were considerably well to do then. They had a grocery that was making money.
EM:Where was this grocery?
PK:It was here in Mponda, Mangochi.
EM:Ok, ok. And in the 1960s, there were a lot of political upheavals due to the Kamuzu Banda’s rule, did it affect you as a young man growing in Mangochi?
PK:Not at all. I was not involved.
EM:Around the same period there was the Chikanga myths (1960s) here in Mangochi. Did this affect you and your childhood? Were you aware of this?
PK:Not at all. It did not affect me. Yes, I heard about it.
EM:Oh! Ok. So, a young man, just finished his leaving certificate, and wanted to leave the country to go to work in the mines, in South Africa. What really motivated you?
PK:Ok. You see when I finished school, like any child wanted to get married. Yet, I had no money at all to use for the wedding. Also, I asked myself, even if I get married today, what will I do with the kids to be born in the family? Will I have the money to send them to school? This is really what motivated me to migrate to South Africa.
PK:Yes. I planned myself that when I go to South Africa I can make money, keep some for my wedding, future fees for my children, food for my household.
EM:Did you get motivated by anyone who was already there in the mines that you knew off?
PK:Yes, there was a man who went to South Africa to work in the mines. When he came back home, he sent to school all his children, fed them well, lived a decent life. That motivated me.
EM:Oh, that’s great story. So that time this man was in South Africa already?
PK:Yes, he was there already.
EM:Your own parents, how did they take it when you announced to them of your intention to migrate?
PK:At first, they did not like the idea. But after explaining to them of my objectives of helping them by looking after myself financially, and that I wanted to find funds to finance my wedding, build a future for my future children, they understood and supported me. They said let God give him what he wants. They knew I wanted to set up my future too.
EM:In this case you went to South Africa under the WNLA contract, right?
EM:Ok. So, what was the main process of acquiring such WNLA contract?
PK:Actually, we had to go to the labour office to get the license. Then they sent you to the hospital to have examinations to ascertain that you are physically fit to work in the mines. Then they set a date for your departure.
EM:At the hospital what were they looking for?
EM:Vaccination? Which one?
PK:Yes, they wanted to find out if you got polio vaccination (katemera wa nthomba). Also, they wanted to find out if you have the and WNLA accepted weight and height on the scale. Considering that I was young they wanted to find out if I have the right weight and height to manage works in the mine. There were many others who were indeed being left out as they did not meet the accepted weight/height by the South African mine authorities.
EM:But you passed all the tests?
PK:Yes, I did pass to the surprise of many as I was very young. I saw many of them being turned back. Some would be told to go home and get fitter before they come back….(laughs aloud). That’s the process. They were not just taking people as long as they have applied.
EM:Oh wow! So, after this process they were giving you date? Like you are leaving this Tuesday or Friday?
EM:So, how were travelling? what was the mode of transport?
PK:When we got a date from labour office, we would go there and then be picked by a transport to Wenela Bus Depot in Blantyre. here we would be waiting till our day arrives for departure to South Africa. We would travel through train.
EM:Where were you getting the train?
PK:We were getting the train at Limbe Depot. Those travelling would be made to prepare for the journey.
EM:So, the management would come and announce who would be travelling that particular day?
PK:Yes, they would come and announce those travelling, 25, 30 or 50 are travelling by train today.
EM:Where was the train going?
PK:To Mozambique then Zimbabwe and Botswana
EM:This train was it transporting people going to WNLA?
PK:This train was only picking those workers going to the mines under WNLA.
EM:You mean to say it took no other passengers? Only those by WNLA destined mines in South Africa?
PK:Yes, only WNLA workers no other. Other bogs were empty.
EM:So, you mean on the way the train did not pick any passengers even of WNLA say from Zimbabwe?
PK:No ways. It was only transporting Malawian WNLA workers. Zimbabwe, Mozambique all had their own trains.
EM:Oh ok. So, when you get into South Africa, they welcomed you and sent you to school? Where was this school? Outside or within the mine?
PK:The school is outside the mine. Although this school is only for miners.
EM:Oh ok, and the teachers were they black Africans or white? And what content were they teaching you?
PK:They were all black. They were teaching us how to be both in the mine and outside the mine. They also taught us the language used by miners (Fanakalo)
EM:So, when you get the mine, how were you housed? Independent house or common house?
PK:We were put into compounds. Like me I was in Biskop mines. So, I was housed in E Compound.
PK:There were like 20 compounds. We were all mixed though Malawians would be in their own compound. The Shaganis (from Mozambique), Xosas (local South Africans) all had their own blocks of compounds.
EM:So, there were no mixing of people of different countries in the blocks of compounds?
PK:No! No! there was no mixing, Malawians had their own block of compounds, so the Mozambicans.
EM:So that way when Malawians are amongst themselves could speak their language, say Chichewa? Mozambicans Shangani etc.?
PK:Yes. When we met Malawians, we could speak Chichewa but when we mix with other nationalities, we spoke fanakalo.
EM:On a working day, what did you report to work in the mine?
PK:We reported to work at 6am. You clocked in, get into the train/lift into downstairs the mines
EM:So, you woke up, get ready, at 6am report at the station, clock in, and off into the cage-lifts to your specific level in the mine?
PK:Exactly. When you get into the cage lift you go down to your stage like mine was in stage 15. Others in the lift could continue to 16, 17 etc.
EM:I get you. How about sanitation? How was it like inside the mines? Did you have cleanliness measures?
PK:Oh! Sanitation was a major issue in the mines. Very very clean indeed. We had moveable toilets, well closed. When it is full, it was elevated to get rid of the dirty outside.
PK:Yes. We had no issue on health security
EM:Tell me something about the Izibondo?
PK:Yes! Yes! This was the head, leader appointed to take care of the compound. And when he sees you are young, like what I was, they would want to sleep with you (Matanyula).
EM:Oh! I see. So, these were leaders?
PK:Yes, they had so many powers within themselves. They could abuse us the way they wanted. He was the most fearful people in mine.
EM:So, could they be reported to his superiors? If so, what actions or punishment were they given?
PK:When reported mostly were removed and sent back home.
EM:Amongst the Izibondo were there Malawians?
PK:Yes but a few. Mostly were the Shanganis. Very few were Malawians.
PK:Oh! The food was fantastic. The had a variety of food. You could choose what you liked that particular day.
EM:Great stuff. So, before you left for South Africa, would you probably know someone, a relative who was already there?
PK:Ohm no. I didn’t know anyone there.
PK:Yes, I just left with knowing anyone already there.
EM:Oh! Ok. And what was your relationship with miners of other countries?
PK:We had a good working relationship with other miners from different countries. We respected each other and treated each other as one family. We shared objectives.
EM:Brilliant. So, what was your job in the mine?
PK:I was working as Tchisa boy (horse boy)
PK:I was the one who would clean the stones with water horse pipe. There was too much dust in the mines. Hence water horse pipe would clean the dust, plus marking the square meter, an area to be dug.
EM:So, when you meet within the mine with other workers from other different countries, what language were you using to communicate?
PK:We used Bantu language called Fanakalo.
EM:Oh! this Bantu language spoken in the mines only?
PK:Yes, only in the mines. Outside no one would understand the language.
EM:As a young man working in the mine, were you able to make a relationship with outside girls?
PK:No ways. You can’t have such relationships.
PK:Because you can easily lose weight if you indulge in sexual relationships. The nature of the job would not really be conducive to be reckless. You would not stay longer to finish your contract.
PK:Most men were running away from their contracts. They would go to the Malawian leader to inform him he would not manage to finish the contract. (Nilefilikile nayamba khaya manji {I want to go home, I have failed})
EM:Okay. Would that be driven by desire to have sexual relationship?
PK:Yes. And immediately he would be relieved of duty and sent back home. They would not hold him at all.
EM:Okay. Would they offer him anything monetary wise?
PK:Nothing. Since you have chosen to leave without honouring your contract, they were not obliged to pay you anything.
EM:How was the management seeing you as people of different nations? Was there some sort of segregation?
PK:In the mine, there was not any segregation. We were treated the same
EM:Oh! Ok that’s great. I thought they would favour people of one country to the other.
PK:No ways. The white manager really loved me. When I knocked off, he would pick me to his house, I met his family and have dinner together. After that he would drive me back to the mine. No segregation at all.
EM:Wow that is good to hear. And was there a moment you requested the management for wage increment? What about striking over salary hike?
EM:So, it meant you were all happy with the renumeration?
PK:Very much so. And if you wanted to make more money, you could request for extra shifts/overtime. You could increase the income through extra hours.
EM:That was good. Now while in South Africa was Malawi government represented? Someone who listened to your welfare.
PK:Yes, Malawi Ambassador was taking care of us. He was our representative.
EM:Where was he based? Pretoria or South Africa?
PK:He was staying in Johannesburg.
EM:Is that the place you took your concerns? Did you ever go to him for assistance while working in the mines?
PK:Not at all. I did not have any problem that warranted his services
EM:That is great. Why in the mines, were you able to listen to radios or TVs? If so, what news were you listening to?
PK:Yes, we used to listen to the radio. However, we were listening to the local channels and only local south African news
EM:So, you did not have a chance to listen to anything from home?
EM:Was there a program or new radio that you enjoyed watching or listening to?
PK:There was no news. They liked putting music channels only.
EM:What was the reason why they didn’t put news channels?
PK:Not sure why? And if you want to get some news, you will need to go to the shops to buy newspapers.
EM:So, newspapers were accepted?
PK:Very much so. We could at times read what is happening in Malawi in the local newspapers.
EM:Were you like having off days?
PK:Yes. Basically, Saturday and Sunday. When we had overtime, we could work up to Sunday.
EM:Were you like going out on your free days? (Saturday and Sundays)?
PK:Not often because we were afraid of thugs. Remember we were foreigners, and they could easily identify us as foreigners working in the mines.
EM:Were you also watching films, movies on your free days?
PK:No, we weren’t watching at all. Only listening to music on the radio.
EM:Were you at times being worried about losing your job in the middle of your contract?
PK:Oh! No. We were very protected. Unless one chooses to play around and decide to quit the contract.
EM:During your off days were you able to attend prayer services?
PK:Yes. They allowed us to go to our churches and mosques. Like in my case am a Moslem, I would request in the mine to work half day that I can attend prayer services at the nearest Mosque.
EM:Me Oh! Great. So, most of these Fridays you worked half day?
PK:Yes, soon after work I would rush to the Mosque to pray with other congregants. I would knock off at 10am, get to the hostel and leave at 11am for the Mosque
EM:So, for you Saturday and Sunday remained your off days?
EM:While at the mine, did you create a close relationship with anyone from other countries?
PK:Yes, I did have one, Armando from Mozambique.
EM:Do you still have that relationship with him?
PK:No! the relationship ended when we partied ways. His name was Armando Antonio
EM:Oh, I see, Armando Antonio. While working in the mine, was there an occasion where you or someone else did get injured?
PK:For me I finished my whole contract without seeing any miner getting injured in the mine. That’s at least from my section, could be different from other sections of the mine.
EM:It has been a common complaint amongst those in the mining industry that they mostly suffer from TB and Tychosis (Not sure what it is. Though he mentioned several times). Did you ever suffer from it?
PK:Indeed, this is common in the mines due to too much dust. Many miners suffered TB, and I suffered Tychosis (sp). It took me 21 days to heal.
EM:Oh really, sorry. So, you were treated of it within the mine or outside?
PK:I was getting the treatment outside the mine.
EM:Were you being transported of you could go alone to get the treatment?
PK:I used to go alone. When my medicine finished, I could go out to get extra medicine.
EM:Were you rested when you were diagnosed with the tychosis?
PK:No. I was still working while on medication
EM:In your section how many people suffered from this disease?
PK:We were at least three miners who suffered from this disease in my section.
EM:But the management of the mine assisted with treatment?
EM:Let me ask again this question. Back home when you going through the process of acquiring this WNLA contract, was there at any point where government officials requested a kickback to fasten your application?
PK:No ways. There was no any act like that one at all. No corruption during the Kamuzu’s regime. (Dr Hastings Kamuzu Banda era)
EM:No corruption during Kamuzu’s time
PK:(laughs)not at all, he was a no nonsense. It was like you would fear his omnipresent.
EM:So, what was your wage like?
PK:In my case I was receiving R1,37 per day.
EM:So R1.37 cents. What about a monthly wage?
PK:We were getting half wage as the other half was remitted directly to our savings account back home in Malawi.
EM:So, how was this possible?
PK:Before we left for South Africa, we were required to open up a savings account that WNLA can remit directly.
EM:The remitted money was it given to the parents and relatives?
PK:That money remained the account. Nobody had access to it. This is the money we received when we came back home. We got it upon arrival.
EM:Oh okay. That’s wonderful.
PK:Yes. That’s the money I used at my wedding. The remainder remained in my account. Helped me start my business and educated my children.
EM:So, you mean the other half that you received while worked in the mines in South Africa was enough for clothing, and other expenditures?
PK:Yes, it was very enough.
EM:Did you use that money to buy anything of significance while in South Africa?
PK:Not really. If anything, I bought bicycle and clothing materials such as blankets
EM:Since you did not have a woman, most of your monies were idle and well kept?
EM:So, you only bought bicycle? Where did you buy it? South Africa?
PK:No, I bought it here upon arrival.
EM:Tell me, while in South Africa, was it possible to leave the mines and contract and go and look for different employment? Like gardening etc.?
PK:Yes, it was very possible
EM:It wasn’t problem with government and immigrations?
PK:No, it was not a problem. However, the government or the mining company was not to pay for his transportation back home. He would need to source his own money. He was no longer on a contract.
EM:What if you are outside, and now your contracted days with the mine are over and want to remain in the country, would you just go to immigration to renew your contract?
PK:No, you needed to come back home to renew, they would not allow you to renew while in South Africa.
EM:What about people trying to come to South Africa through WNLA legal contract?
PK:Yes, people used to do that too. They would get the contract with WNLA and when they arrive in the mine, they would stay a few days and run away to go get other piece jobs other than the mines. Many also did that
EM:Wow! So, people could that?
PK:Yes. And many who did that are very rich now. They are millionaires in South Africa. They married there and have settled there.
PK:Because they received more money outside the mine jobs compared to us in the mines. Inside WNLA paid according to Government’s salary scale which was normal. Outside they paid higher than the government scale.
PK:Outside it was not regularized. While in the mines, we were regularized. Dr. Kamuzu Banda made sure they paid us less not to go beyond those on the government pay roll. To him, if these miners received higher than the government officers, they would be boasting as very important than them. They would be pompous. (Some sort of injustice)
EM:That’s some injustice. Not fair at all. During your time in the mines, did the apartheid felt outside affected you in anyway?
EM:What about when you left the mines? Would you encounter apartheid through the police and citizens?
PK:We hardly moved out of the mines. If we did, we had numbers tucked on our arms to indicate that we are foreign miners. The police really respected us. We had no issues at all.
EM:Even if the police were white? They would bully you?
PK:Not all, we had a very good reputation and respected us and protected us.
EM:Now towards the end, when the contract is about to end (1974) what motivated you to come back home?
PK:For me, it was obvious. I wanted to go back home to find a woman to marry.
EM:Ok. You had objectives to achieve in South Africa and now you want to go back home to implement them?
EM:Wow! Fantastic, so when you came back home, how did the parents receive you back?
PK:They received me well.
EM:Oh! Ok that our son had left and now is back home safely and with full of energy.
PK:Yes, and immediately found a woman and married her.
PK:Yes, I was hungry. I needed a woman that now I had money.
EM:hahahahaahhahah that was great. You had everything. Nothing really to delay you. Ok.
PK:Yes. You see I married in 1975, and in 1977 got my first born.
EM:So, you left for South Africa in 1972, first time. You arrived there and got inducted into the mine’s etiquette, mine language (fanakalo), started to work effectively, you got sick of TB and Sycosis. You got well treated and came back home well and fit. While sick did you continue working?
PK:No, I stopped working for 21 days while receiving treatment.
EM:I was wondering. So, when you were healed resumed to work till the end of your contract (1974). Upon completion of your contract, you came home. Tell me when you got home, did you get your money in the saving account tampered by government or any other officials?
PK:No, I found it intact untampered.
EM:Ok. I have already scanned your documents. And this should be it. Is there anything you would like to add?
PK:To add is to ask the current government to push South African government to remit the bonuses that we did not receive. The money we left behind in South Africa. Some of us are alive and other unfortunately have died will not be able to receive these money. They should hasten the processes whatever they are.
EM:So, you mean the money got to Malawi and is Malawi Government?
PK:Yes, this money was remitted to Malawi government and sitting idle somewhere.
EM:Is this money (bonus) calculated per individual case or just sent a chunk of it and asked the Malawi Government to administer it?
PK:I don’t know what process they have adopted.
EM:What about those who have died, what is going to happen?
PK:I think they are going to remit to their beneficiaries.
EM:No, I want to thank you for the information you have given me. This is very important to our project. Thank you for your consent to use this information in the book(s), articles, website, and other forms deemed feasible. We would hope your grandchildren will appreciate that we kept your experiences.
